the Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 License.
the Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 License.
Quantifying ice crystal growth rates in natural clouds from glaciogenic cloud seeding experiments
Abstract. Ice crystals are essential in the evolution of mixed-phase clouds, as ice crystals can quickly grow to large sizes by vapor diffusion and thereby trigger precipitation formation. Vapor diffusional growth rates of ice crystals were quantitatively studied in the laboratory for several decades, forming the basis of various ice crystal growth models. Since field measurements generally only provide snapshots that lack information on ice crystal age or changes induced by cloud processes, significant gaps remain in quantitative field observations impeding the validation of laboratory experiments and models.
Our study addresses this gap through innovative glaciogenic cloud seeding experiments in persistent low-level stratus clouds in the CLOUDLAB project. The controllability and repeatability of our seeding experiments facilitates quantifying diffusional ice crystal growth rates in natural clouds via in situ measurements. We report growth rates of 0.17–0.81 µm s-1 (major axis of pristine ice crystals) from 14 seeding experiments between -5.1 to -8.3 °C. We also observe how microphysical characteristics induce strong variations in the growth rates, e.g., reduced growth rates in seeding-induced regions of high ice crystal number concentrations. For better comparison to laboratory and non-seeded clouds, we developed two filtering methods to isolate growth conditions less affected by the experimental setup. The comparison shows that the temperature-dependent growth rate variations align with laboratory data, whereas absolute laboratory values are higher. Our findings provide valuable insights into the vapor diffusional growth of ice crystals in natural clouds and connect in situ observations with laboratory and modeling studies.
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Status: open (until 16 Apr 2025)
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RC1: 'Comment on egusphere-2025-688', Alexei Korolev, 07 Apr 2025
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The comment was uploaded in the form of a supplement: https://egusphere.copernicus.org/preprints/2025/egusphere-2025-688/egusphere-2025-688-RC1-supplement.pdf
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RC2: 'Comment on egusphere-2025-688', Darrel Baumgardner, 08 Apr 2025
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The work presented here is an elegant approach to validating laboratory crystal growth studies using in situ measurements. I think that the authors have done a commendable job of putting the results into an understandable and, mostly, defendable arguments. I say "mostly" because I do have a number of concerns that I need to be addressed before I accept this for publication. Even though I gave the paper "excellents" in the three categories, there are a number of issues that need clarification. In addition, as I will state in my concluding remarks, because of the implications that this study has for operational cloud seeding, I strongly suggest that the authors include in the introduction and concluding remarks some discussion on how the results from this study can improve the current state of glaciogenic seeding.
Issues:
1) I have not read the Ramelli et al (2024) papers, so if this question was addressed there, then it should be reiterated in this paper because of its relevance to connecting what is produced by the burning flare to what is measured downwind. The flare burns for 5-6 minutes and contains approximately 200 g of material, 20 g of which is silver iodide. Two questions: 1) How many ice crystals would be expected to activate from 20 g of AgI and are the number of new crystals detected downwind consistent with expectations? and 2) What is the composition of the other 180 g of material and is it completely hydrophobic, i.e. no possibility of being IN or CCN?
2) Nothing is mentioned about the water vapor pressures in these clouds, i.e. even if ice crystals are activated in supersaturation (SS) wrt ice < 100%, they can't grow if the environment is not >100% SS wrt ice. What is maintaining these clouds SS, just the WBF mechanism?
3) The CDNCs of up to 400-500 cm-3 seem quite high for a wintertime, shallow stratiform cloud, can the authors reference other studies in such clouds where the CDNCs are this high?
Ramifications for operational glaciogenic seeding
Cloud seeding to enhance precipitation remains a controversial topic, particularly since many cloud seeding operators are inclined to use their "instincts" when dispersing seeding material, rather than taking a more scientific approach, i.e. selecting the time and location to release material based on cloud microphysical conditions. The results of this study have clear implications with respect to assisting seeding programs to improve their effectiveness. I think a word to that effect in the introduction then a follow-up in the conclusions would be a help to the weather modification community.
Citation: https://doi.org/10.5194/egusphere-2025-688-RC2
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